All of the above! (Laz Mix!)

Recording engineering discussions and questions. Also a great place to discuss software, plugins, and computer based recording/arranging.
TRGuitar
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 21st, 2012, 4:08 pm

Is it better? Was it the Sans Amp?
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grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
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Moonrider
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by Moonrider » September 21st, 2012, 4:20 pm

Moonrider wrote:
TRGuitar wrote:OK ..... so the Sans Amp might be the devil? How does this sound. Disclaimer! No Compression! No limiter!

http://soundcloud.com/wickedfester/cold ... ver-take-4

Peavey Classic 30. No pedals. Post gain at 6 (these go to 12). Shure SM57 on center close mic and Audio Technica for distant mic. Epiphone Les Paul Standard. Miller Light to chanel Ace Frehley!

PS Wife now officially hates Cold Gin. :roll: :mrgreen:

Oh Crap! I think I owe Laz some new guitar tracks to work with! :shock: Working on it......

Is the "pumping" gone now Doug? I did notice it too .... :oops:
Right where the bass/drums comes in, something is crushing the bejabbers out of the whole mix.
The previous version had a download link. Soundcloud is compressing the <OH! you potty mouthed boy!> out of the broadcast stream. The downloaded mp3 sounded fine. I'd still like to hear what V4 sounds like before soundcloud butchers it ;)
Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.

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TRGuitar
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 21st, 2012, 4:25 pm

I sent you the MP3 and as I mentioned in the E-Mail ... THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME! I appreciate it. 8)
"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,
grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
-- The Webb Wilder Credo --

Moonrider
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by Moonrider » September 21st, 2012, 5:34 pm

TRGuitar wrote:I sent you the MP3 and as I mentioned in the E-Mail ... THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME! I appreciate it. 8)
You're welcome, Terry.

Just to let everyone know, here's the reply I sent:

"Soundcloud is definitely strapping a limiter set to stun across the audio stream they're sending out. Probably dropping the bandwith to 64kbps too.

The downloaded mp3 of version three is a really nice mix, but I like the guitar sound in version 4 better. Version four needs the drums and bass bumped back up a hair.

Now how do you deal with soundcloud crushing the audio stream? Oddly enough, the answer is add some compression to it yourself. Do another mix and apply the SC4 effect with the following settings changed from the defaults:

RMS/Peak: -10
Threshold: -20
Ratio: 3
Makeup Gain: 2db

What you do here is add some GENTLE, soft knee, compression to bring the peaks of the file down a smidge so that Soundcloud's limiter doesn't trigger. You won't notice it playing back the mp3, and Soundcloud won't smash the snot out of it when it's streamed."
Playing guitar and never playing for others is like studying medicine and never working in a clinic.

Moondawgs on Reverbnation

rparker
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by rparker » September 21st, 2012, 6:08 pm

I've heard some product demos that made the audio sound absolutely wretched. Boss's "Tone Room". If you heard this before buying the product, you'd never buy the product. That one I could hear. That's how bad it was.

TR, I've got my cans packed away, so I'll give the newest a listen tomorrow night.

Moonrider, I've got to admit that my sorry ears couldn't pick up anything, but now that I have a spot to look for, I'll check it out. It's wild how they would squeeze it to that extent. You'd think that somebody, somewhere along the line would have done something. yeah, everyone's gotta have a dream, I guess. :lol: :lol:

Oh, one other thing. I'm very curious to know how the known good MP3 would sound in Sound Click. It was the one lots of people were using until a few years ago.
Roy

"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 21st, 2012, 6:39 pm

Cool! I can back off on the rhythm track and who needs Sound Cloud? I can try Reverb Nation or use my Sound Click account or something and see how that sounds. Yes, I understand the paradox of adding my own compression to stop theirs from triggering. It does make sense! Cool! 8)
"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,
grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
-- The Webb Wilder Credo --

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by bkangel » September 21st, 2012, 6:47 pm

rparker wrote:
Oh, one other thing. I'm very curious to know how the known good MP3 would sound in Sound Click. It was the one lots of people were using until a few years ago.
I'd be really interested to know about this too. I've only just opened a Soundclick account, and if I'm better off going elsewhere, I'm certainly willing too (although it won't help the raw input :lol: ).
What I lack in talent and natural ability, I will have to make up with stubborness.

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by jwmartin » September 22nd, 2012, 10:43 am

I like the guitar sounds of version 4 much better. Less tiring to listen to. It's sounding great now!

TRGuitar
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 22nd, 2012, 11:40 am

Thanks! I guess a mic and tube amp is the way to go.
"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,
grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
-- The Webb Wilder Credo --

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by rparker » September 22nd, 2012, 3:27 pm

Version 4's guitar tones are really great.

I'm afraid I just don't know what to listen for on that compression thing yet. I'll do some you-tubing. I understand the concept and all, just not what it sounds like.
Roy

"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by jwmartin » September 22nd, 2012, 4:13 pm

rparker wrote:Version 4's guitar tones are really great.

I'm afraid I just don't know what to listen for on that compression thing yet. I'll do some you-tubing. I understand the concept and all, just not what it sounds like.
Yea, if you want to hear terrible compression, you will find it on youtube. :D

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 23rd, 2012, 1:32 pm

Yeah, that compressoin stuff really stinks. I'm gonna give Doug's soft knee treatment a shot on my days off as well.
"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,
grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
-- The Webb Wilder Credo --

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Laz
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by Laz » September 25th, 2012, 11:12 am

Moonrider wrote:Now how do you deal with soundcloud crushing the audio stream? Oddly enough, the answer is add some compression to it yourself. Do another mix and apply the SC4 effect with the following settings changed from the defaults:

RMS/Peak: -10 Range is 0 to 1db.
Threshold: -20
Ratio: 3
Makeup Gain: 2db

What you do here is add some GENTLE, soft knee, compression to bring the peaks of the file down a smidge so that Soundcloud's limiter doesn't trigger. You won't notice it playing back the mp3, and Soundcloud won't smash the snot out of it when it's streamed."
I've been using the standard Compressor in Audacity to level out our practice recordings. I use the following settings:

Threshold: -12
Noise Floor: -40
Ratio: 3.0
Attack: 0.2s
Release: 2.0

Make up gain (check)
Compress on Peaks (no check - this causes pumping)

After that, I apply the Hard Limiter at -2db, and then Amplify by 1.8db to get the level up.

Moonrider: How do you compare the Compressor with SC-4?

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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by TRGuitar » September 25th, 2012, 12:38 pm

Cool! I can't wait to try these settings out. Later today I hope.
"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard, sleep hard,
grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em."
-- The Webb Wilder Credo --

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Laz
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Re: All of the above! (Version 4)

Post by Laz » September 25th, 2012, 12:53 pm

FYI - ReverbNation is not the best choice for posting more than a few songs, as they charge for extra storage space. They have pretty good integration tools with FB etc, and are good for promoting your band, but not for casual use. I think Nick uses SoundClick to good advantage.

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